Wondering what was happening, I contacted the TA on Sunday and was told an answer would be forthcoming. Today, Wednesday afternoon, February 5th, I received the answer.
I can't quote this message, as the message was personal and I don't have authorization, but the response was both confusing and, frankly, nonsensical. On one hand, I was informed, the TA member's post and its follow-up commentary were removed because the TA "Communications Team" wanted everyone to focus on this:
http://www.stpcvta.org/ta/
And on the other hand, the TA moderators (the "Communications Team," as they were called in the message) are trying to group together comments on a particular topic, and that post became victim of a plan to assemble posts concerning the management office today.
I have no idea which individuals comprise the "TA Communications Team" (the TA seems to be adopting CWCapital's secrecy levels) but the hall monitor quality of deleting posts/merging posts/etc has been particularly acute these recent days, as if some member of the "Communications Team" has been left alone to his or her own devices, and, crazed, has run rampant with newly found power. I think it's a terrible and insulting way to run a Facebook page, overly authoritarian and contrary to the easy-going and friendly exchange of commentary on topics of interest and value to tenants. I can understand bouncing out comments that have nothing to do with the subject at hand or which are insulting or noxious, but the post that was deleted just contained vital new information that was surely of interest to residents and members of the TA.
Worse, a replacement "authorized" post turns up a today, four days later, offering up, almost as a scoop, a similar photo to the one that was deleted on Saturday, and manufacturing an impression that the TA and Dan Garodnick are at the forefront of those concerned about the new management office and determined to find out just what the hell is happening. What took them so long? And why are they giving the impression that they've been awake the entire time, rather than asleep, disinterested or just plain unsure of what action to take?
At this point, considering the evidence before me, I can only come to the conclusion that the elimination of the link to the Stuy Town Report page was a purposeful negation directed provocatively at this blog by a member of the "TA Communications Team" left in charge over the weekend, and that the leader of this team has tried to cover this up upon his return by reposting in one thread the comments deleted, but not, of course, the original post that provided a link to the blog.
I have generally supported the TA and have countered on occasion its critics in the comment section or by not passing through the most outrageous comments directed at the TA that I have come across. (And there have been a bunch.) My position regarding the TA has been changing recently, however, and the current rationale for the deletion of posts there confirms that my still evolving views are the correct course. Yes, the TA can be useful, but it is to be considered only an auxiliary in the fight for affordable housing and an imperfect, even flawed fighter at that. I still support it to a limited, expiring extent, but not anymore with dues, however. Sorry. I'm not going to pay for the privilege of getting disappointed. As of today, I am not a member of the TA.
We, the tenants, have the right and responsibility to go after tenant matters that concern us without the reliance on the TA or our elected officials. My one regret is that I cannot attend to this 100% or even 50% or 25% due to time constraints. What I will try to do in the coming weeks is offer up proactive guides, so that we, as individuals, can seek our own recourse, our own sense of fairness and justice.
Well written. Well said.
ReplyDeleteSadly, the Tenants Association no longer represents the tenants. The more I see their behavior, the more I mistrust them and the more I despise the manipulative and opportunistic Goradnick.
ReplyDeleteThe TA --of which I am a dues-paying member -- lost my respect today. Who or what does the TA fear? And are the TA officers and leaders being bullied by someone or some entity? A reasonable person following this issue has to wonder whether to renew their dues.
ReplyDeleteI don't know what's happening with the TA. We complain about the non-transparency of CWCapital but the TA is right there along with them in that department.
ReplyDeleteWho or what does the TA fear? And are the TA officers and leaders being bullied by someone or some entity? >>>
ReplyDeleteThat's exactly what I've been thinking. They seem to be under somebody's control. They were never this wussy and, at the same time, so authoritarian. Something is seriously amiss. I hope for everybody's sake they do a little self-examination because they are self-destructing at the moment.
Well, the TA has ceased to exist for me, except as a nagging ache. I'm still very much pissed at what happened over the weekend and don't envision myself coming back to the fold, ever. Nice going, TA Communication Team!
ReplyDeleteBring back Al Doyle.
ReplyDeleteThe old TA with Al used to teach us how to stand up for ourselves whenever we had a problem. He never treated us like this TA. He coached us on who to call for what. He had us use our own voice.
ReplyDeleteThis TA wants to shut us up, do all our talking for us, do it behind closed doors so we never know what is said. They aren't right the head.
Totally agree 11:45
ReplyDeleteScarier is "wussy" and "authoritarian" is a lethal combination that comes with control issues and anger management issues and that is what I now see in the TA.
Did you read their invite on the link?
Now they want us to come to another one of their meetings with lies where they try to control what we think and what we say obviously as their invite dictates what can be discussed ONLY.
They don't want to hear what we have to say. They want to have their say so we go off thinking what they tell us because we are empty bobble heads following their lead and nodding along.
We've heard enough from the TA. These bobble heads will be nodding off elsewhere.
STR is right. We are stronger when when we act and speak as "individuals" in a group.
ReplyDeleteWe are weaker when we are individually quiet with one voice doing our speaking.
We are screwed when that one voice speaking does it secretly.
The power is in the roar of all our voices. A collection of smart, educated, individuals.
The TA acts with greater secrecy than the NSA. Somehow they think that their actions need to be top secret unless they decide to divulge something to the rest of us"mere" tenants.
ReplyDeleteI believe that the last couple of years they are trying to deal with CW in secret in the hope that when CW sells this dump they will sell it to the tenants. What they consistently fail to understand is that CW will sell to the group offering the best deal to the owners. If it is the tenants , then fine, but they are never going to sell to the tenants just to be nice
The TA hasn't been the TA since they let Garodnick lead them down the path of ownership. He and his team of lawyers (who will profit handsomely if ST is sold to Brookfield) have lead the board to believe they will make maximum profit if they buy, hold then sell. There actions have been guided more by the profit motive than any concern for tenants. Al Doyle was the Chairman when this all started and was behind the first failed (thankfully) attempt to buy. Not sure he is the savior some make him out to be.
ReplyDeleteA meeting? gghhurrrghcoverup
ReplyDeleteI've sadly decided to remove my name from the TA Unity Pledge. Does anyone reading this know how to do that?
ReplyDelete"authority" to post on TA Facebook?
ReplyDeleteWe don't need another meeting. We got the picture. I'm out too.
"I've sadly decided to remove my name from the TA Unity Pledge. Does anyone reading this know how to do that?"
ReplyDeleteIf you signed the unity pledge you are a member of the Tenants Association. The only way out of membership is to call and demand that they remove your name from their membership list. Otherwise, whether you pay dues or not they will continue to count you as a non voting member who supports their actions. Keep calling to verify as they do not want to remove your name.
>>I've sadly decided to remove my name from the TA Unity Pledge. Does anyone reading this know how to do that?<<
ReplyDeleteI would believe you'd have to contact the TA.
>>Al Doyle was the Chairman when this all started and was behind the first failed (thankfully) attempt to buy. Not sure he is the savior some make him out to be.<<
ReplyDeleteIf the tenants had won that bid, they'd be in the same boat that Tishman-Speyer found themselves in. What's outrageous is that we are carrying the burden of a 3 billion dollar default on our backs and the presence of CWCapital.
10:58 that explains why Dan and the TA push secretly for new expensive office building. A higher price means he and his buddies make more money. Now Dan rears his head and TA are "manufacturing" opposition after its too late. Same thing they did to us with the midlease increase. They agreed to terms of the Roberts settlement including midlease increases to raise the rent intake which raises the property value. Same damn thing. When its too late Dan rears his head and pretends to be on our side with his little press conference saying its unfair to tenants after it is too damn late. Their best remedy was to postpone the increase to end of lease. We won the Roberts case until TA and Dan settled with crappy terms. Everything Dan and TA do is to raise the property value by robbing tenants and commercializing the land. Go away Get-Rich-Dan!
ReplyDeleteWhy is the Tishman 3 billion dollar burden on tenants back? Oh because our lawmakers won't write laws to protect tenants during foreclosures, only laws to protect billionaire investors.
ReplyDeleteWe do need new lawmakers this election year. Vote them all out!
The TA is telling us the only thing we can bring up at this meeting? What are we, toddlers? I don't even talk to my kids like that. I wouldn't let anyone talk to my kids like that or to me.
ReplyDeleteI know for a fact that there is at least one law firm (as well as Paul Weiss) salivating at the prospect of getting involved in a sale of the property. This property generates zillions of dollars in fees for lawyers. They are like hungry sharks circling the property waiting for the chance of a feeding frenzy.
ReplyDelete"They agreed to terms of the Roberts settlement"
ReplyDeleteINCORRECT. NEITHER DAN NOR THE TA HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE TERMS OF THE ROBERTS SETTLEMENT. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT AND STOP SPREADING MISINFORMATION.
They didn't have anything to do with the terms, but both pushed for Roberts, and Garodnick was all over it via Press Releases.
ReplyDeleteAnd now that I think about it, Garodnick was very enthusiastic about Roberts, and a major promoter.
ReplyDeleteThis is not an insult and please do not take it that way, but STR, you just declared that this is your blog and you'll run it your way a few posts ago. This isn't to suggest that the way the TA runs theirs is good, bad or indifferent. But aren't they entitled to run theirs their way too?
ReplyDeleteKeep up the good work.
To the troll that's trying to get through with messages here: No, the deletion of a post at the TA Facebook is not the same as me not letting through your trolling, annoying and insulting messages. The message that was deleted on the TA Facebook had nothing of a troll, annoying element to it. It was not insult, mere information.
ReplyDeleteAnd, yes, this is my blog, but the TA Facebook is, one would think, jointly "owned" and used by members of the TA, not just the playground of one hall monitor with an authoritarian hand.
Sorry. No pass.
If bringing the Roberts case was a bad idea, it was only a bad idea in retrospect. The Roberts DECISION was a fantastic - and righteous - win for tenants. It was the way the SETTLEMENT after the decision was handled that destroyed what should have been a resounding victory for tenants. You can thank the lawyers for the two sides and the judge in the settlement case for that. Don't blame it on Garodnick or the TA. Who would have imagined that the settlement would have turned out to be such a fiasco.
ReplyDelete>>But aren't they entitled to run theirs their way too?<<
ReplyDeleteSure.
>>The Roberts DECISION was a fantastic - and righteous - win for tenants.<<
ReplyDeleteNot sure about this. People were certainly bitching about it.
The Roberts case was great. We were strong.
ReplyDeleteThe Roberts ruling was righteous. We won.
The Roberts settlement was despicable. We lost.
“The tenants association will hold its second meeting on the construction of the new management office, February 18, 2014, at P.S. 40 at 6PM. (Enter on E 19th Street, between First and Second Avenues.) The meeting is specifically and solely to address issues related to the construction. All are welcome.”
ReplyDeleteThe meeting agenda was set by CWC/CR since that would not have appeared otherwise. That’s my guess. Even if you hate the TA, why don’t you show up and hear for yourself what the CR/CWC/TA/DOB*/elected officials’** propaganda will be. That way, you get it straight from the horse’s mouth without getting it third hand. It’s also a chance to give some hardball back to them all while you are there. This logic of not showing up escapes me.
*IF they come, as per the TA website, they are “invited”. If they don't show, then it shows what little influence DG has and even more depressing, how the De Blasio administration works re the whole “tale of two cities" narrative. In other words, NYC has “business as usual”, Bloomberg, style, with the real estate industry.
**NYS Senator Brad Hoylman, NYS Assembly Member Brian Kavanagh, and NYC Council Member Dan Garodnick
4:23 its a good point. For all who think that is a good forum and the right group of people to voice your concerns and fury then by all means go. Let loose and let it all out!
ReplyDeleteBut telling the same people over and over again and expecting a different result is too strange for me.
For those who think that collection of people have already proven to be a waste of our time let's all find another forum to tell everyone about what is going on in PCVST. Tell as many people who will listen and who actually make a positive difference. Because we have been talking to these same guys for years. I just don't get it.
Agree with your guess. The agenda was set by CWC/CR. This Real Estate Industry is out of control for too long.
ReplyDeleteI still can't get over the deletion of the post so they can control where tenants focus.
ReplyDelete"Even if you hate the TA, why don’t you show up and hear for yourself what the CR/CWC/TA/DOB*/elected officials’** propaganda will be."
ReplyDeleteAn empty room would be a much stronger message than anything that can be gained by going.
The real estate industry has been running amok in NYC. Where can we get a list of politicians with big money support from the real estate industry so we know who has been bought?
ReplyDeleteAlthough STR frequently censors my posts there is a clear difference between that and the TA doing the same thing. This is one persons blog. Period. The TA's facebook page is a membership page. If a member posts something the TA, it's board or even volunteers should be allowed to respond but not censor/remove. They are supposed to be working FOR the membership, not censoring them and making decisions without notifying members. If the TA wants any credibility back they should open their board meetings and they should submit to an audit. They should have very easily obtained tax documents yet I can't find anything on the IRS website.....why???
ReplyDeletePeople complained because the firts tenants meeting about the management office was just for people in the surrounding buildings. The new meeting will be open to everybody but people are complaining agan and why that is isn't very clear to me. Maybe people just like to complain.
ReplyDeleteI've had it with the TA Facebook page, the two angry women who think it's their blog, and the arbitrary enforcement of a moderation policy. They recently booted some guy "regretfully" because he was making homophobic, sexist comments. What's to regret and why'd you let him run wild for so long? The page has all the order of Beruit in the 80s.
ReplyDeleteThe Communications Committee (re: Marsh with a spliff) wanted to pass the idea off as their own, as if the TA are the ones to break the news. The same way he steals other peoples ideas and passes them off as his own. It's a nasty habit.
The TA are nothing more than an overwhelmed and disorganized bunch of people. I feel for their members who pay dues and get a whole bunch of nothing,
A second meeting from the same people with the same CW agenda saying the same things with a new spin for a do-over of their first meeting. Sorry. No thank you. Nothing they say will change what we all already know. Its says something about them that they always in a pack with words they crafted together.
ReplyDeleteWow they removed the link post and all comments - said a reason would be forthcoming - then posted it days later as if it was brand new? Wow.
ReplyDeleteThere is no good reason to do that. Only bad reasons.
And why they didn't just tell you the reason - why delay that it would be forthcoming. They had to think of something to tell you because they didn't want to tell you the truth on why they did it.. That is the only reason to delay.
Anyone remember Rose Dubinsky and the time the TA sought to serve the community without airs? Some commented about the TA having changed since the announcement of its deal with Brookfield and working closely with Garodnick on this. It's true. Since then, the officers act like some kind of important patronizing hotshots we're all supposed to follow mindlessly. They've really miscalculated. If a sale does occur, people here will be eager for information. They will go to ALL the blog sites. When they do, they will see all the doubt about the TA, and instead of having united the community, the TA will have divided by simply having no clue about how to act inclusively. I'm sure they've developed a bunker mentality now of us against them. They seem to have no clue that they're the ones who created the division.
ReplyDeleteUnity Pledge? Are you freaking kidding? This place is never going to be converted to co-op. Therefore the unity pledge is useless.
ReplyDelete"An empty room would be a much stronger message than anything that can be gained by going."
ReplyDelete"A second meeting from the same people with the same CW agenda saying the same things with a new spin for a do-over of their first meeting. Sorry. No thank you. Nothing they say will change what we all already know."
Yes but what if the DOB shows up? They, not the TA, not CWC/CR, not the gang of 3, will determine if this horror goes forward.
I noticed that a poster was banned because of supposedly "homophobic" comments. However, I never saw any homophobic comments from this person. Maybe I missed whatever he posted that got him banned, but I honestly never saw a homophobic or racist comment from that person.
ReplyDeleteI have come to realize that the TA facebook page is a heavily monitored and heavily censored forum, which means that it is not a forum at all in the true sense of the word. You either toe the party line or YERRROUTTT!
Wow, why make such a mountain out of a molehill? So, they removed a post and replaced it with their own version of the information. The information still got out there. It's not like they were trying to prevent the information from being known.
ReplyDeleteLast summer we asked CW Tom Feeney about the office construction. He said "we will tell you when and how you need to know." This week the TA removed a link to construction information then days later posted pretending it to be an original communication, when and how in the TA opinion, tenants needed to know.
ReplyDeleteSympatico
Wise Words Worth Repeating.
ReplyDelete"We, the tenants, have the right and responsibility to go after tenant matters that concern us without the reliance on the TA or our elected officials. My one regret is that I cannot attend to this 100% or even 50% or 25% due to time constraints. What I will try to do in the coming weeks is offer up proactive guides, so that we, as individuals, can seek our own recourse, our own sense of fairness and justice."
If I was the TA I wouldn't have a blog commentary at all. Just put out news. Otherwise all you get is headaches. This is different here. It's just one person. The tenants blog is supposed to represent we the tenants so they can't have people yelling and screaming at each other like it always happens in a blog. So somebody has to be in charge and make decisions about they can't have this yelling or something and then you get somebody who gets mad at them and wants their money membership back. Who needs all that agita. Get rid of it and let people yell and scream at each other here.
ReplyDelete/// STR wrote, ... the elimination of the link to the Stuy Town Report page was a purposeful negation directed provocatively at this blog by a member of the "TA Communications Team" left in charge over the weekend, and that the leader of this team has tried to cover this up upon his return by reposting in one thread the comments deleted, but not, of course, the original post that provided a link to the blog.///
ReplyDeleteResponse: Shame on the TA. STR has ALWAYS steadfastly stood by you. What a non-thinking jerk they have for a moderator and what poor communication strategy. CW Capital must be ROFL ... this feeds into CW's endgame of "divide and conquer". The more the tenants are squabbling and damaging each other's credibility and standing the better it is for CWCapital.
Everyday the illegal increased rent stressed us making ends meet. Roberts settlement was great sure, great for lawyers and great for those who said they didn't want the burden of Roberts delaying the tenant purchase.
ReplyDelete"There was more than a bit of bristling, however, over the high legal fees, which, at 30 percent of the damages, amount to nearly $20 million. Lawyers and their staff members charged as much as $890 per hour, according to Real Estate Weekly, and the judge joked that he's not even sure he makes $100 an hour. "
http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/04/10/hard_numbers_revealed_as_stuy_town_settlement_approved.php
>>Wow, why make such a mountain out of a molehill? So, they removed a post and replaced it with their own version of the information. The information still got out there. It's not like they were trying to prevent the information from being known.<<
ReplyDeleteThe TA (and by extension Dan Garodnick) wished to frame the entire issue of the construction of the new management office to their advantage. They didn't want it out there that both were very tardy in responding proactively. The link to the Stuy Town Report gave a lie to that. Instead of working together with this blog, the TA and Garodnick have decided to remove a link to it from "official view," so as to present a different time-line of what's been happening. It's not just the photo, it's the information found on this blog and, particularly, in the commentary section, which shows that a few tenants, or even one tenant, stood up for residents with continual challenges at the DOB.
I find this evasion of facts and the crafting of a different and incorrect scenario offense.
I also strongly suspect that something personal is at issue here. That a member of the TA Communications Team was left in charge over the week who has it in for myself and/or the blog, and who decided to take his or her revenge by deleting the post. This post, by the way, came from a longtime active member of the TA and was presented in the spirit of simply passing along new information to the membership; no hidden agenda to be sure.
12:16 am That depends on who from the DOB shows up. It will be interesting to see who shows up to represent the DOB and what they say on behalf of the DOB as the official DOB statement on this.
ReplyDeleteWhat is the mandate of the STPCVTA? I would think it has something to do with representing ‘tenants’ in matters of landlord-tenant dispute. Some years ago I questioned the TA’s mandate and was rebuked. I took issue with the TA spending time and money on efforts to become owner and condo association board members, what I then referred to as the STPCVCA (condo association).
ReplyDeleteSo I see their representation of ‘tenant’ interests as half-hearted these days. Often issues that affect tenants are identified on blogs like this. It’s after a ground swell of articulated frustration that the TA involves itself (think, mgmt. office, QOL issues, commercial use of residentially zoned land… think renegade tenant rally of ice rink).
With the market anticipating a sale of the property this spring, I believe the TA is aligning its BUYER interests and placing its obligation as voice as tenant rep a distant second (at best). So, as the mediator for tenant disputes, the TA is taking a light-handed approach with CW in order, I believe, to retain an open line of communication as the TA prepares to ‘purchase’ the property.
So basically the plan was Dan wanted to send his letter demanding construction information followed by TA posting "newly gotten information" as if the new office photo rendering was a result of Dan's letter which we all know was not new information and was not a result of Dan's letter because STR innocently posted it before Dan's letter because it was already put up on the construction site.
ReplyDeleteWas all this coordinated with the graphic designer of the photo rendering? How long has this crafted scenario been in the works and who all crafted it?
If the DOB goes to the meeting what they say will reveal a lot about their alliance with developers versus their services to NYC'ers.
ReplyDeleteI suspect everything started with the noise about the construction on this blog BEFORE the photo. Where the graphic rendering fits in the time-line is not that important, other than its first public appearance was here,and that this appearance did not fit in with the TA's plan.
ReplyDeleteRe: the graphic rendering of the new management office.
ReplyDeleteIt had to have been made months ago, if not earlier, for CWCapital. I assume these type of renderings are made when plans are being formulated for a new construction. We've seen them before with the amenity buildings.
Boycotting the meeting makes no sense. There's heavy machinery buzzing around the site meaning they're getting ready to break ground and that means there have to be plans. So we'll finally get to see exactly what's being proposed. And the DOB will be there so the rezoning question can finally be cleared up.
ReplyDeleteAll the hate and mistrust is just blinding some people.
I can't make that date, but I would go to the meeting if I could. And residents who live in the affected area should certainly make the attempt to go. Why not?
ReplyDelete"Unity Pledge? Are you freaking kidding? This place is never going to be converted to co-op. Therefore the unity pledge is useless."
ReplyDeleteI disagree that the Unity Pledge is useless. Even if we never have a conversion, it is important that we tenants unite against the scurrilous CW/CR to protest and, if possible, undo some of the damage they are doing. The TA is fighting the latest outrageous round of MCIs and I hope they succeed in that and continue to fight for us against the abuses of the landlord. It's a shame if they have gotten sidetracked because of Garodnick and Brookfield and their ambitions for the property, but we really do need the TA. I hope they get back on track. I plan to continue to be a member.
And, by the way, I'm one of the people whose been reprimanded and got pissed off at the moderator! He/she made me feel like a little kid in school, but if they would cut out that kind of schoolmarmish baloney, and let people speak freely, and focus on being a UNITED front against this hateful landlord (who isn't really a landlord) I think the TA would continue to be very relevant. Or go back to being relevant. Deleting entire posts the way they did with the STR-linked post is way too heavy handed and over the top. That kind of behavior will anger people and turn them against the TA and that is a shame.
"An empty room would be a much stronger message than anything that can be gained by going."
ReplyDeleteYou know what not going to the meeting says? It says, I don't care; go ahead and do whatever you want. Kinda like all the people affected by the mid-lease increases who didn't bother to come out and protest at the leasing office to dissuade others from renting here, to cite one example.
The meeting is open to everyone--show up and make yourself heard by your presence. Do you think this is the last offense to be perpetrated by CW? They shouldn't be emboldened (not that they need any encouragement) to do more stuff like this.
"The TA is telling us the only thing we can bring up at this meeting? What are we, toddlers? I don't even talk to my kids like that. I wouldn't let anyone talk to my kids like that or to me."
Yeah--the TA organized this meeting to deal with a specific issue. Why do you have a problem with that? All the time will be devoted to a situation that has gotten folks riled, even those not directly affected--no distractions, no other topics. If you have a burning need to talk about a different issue (other than kvetching here), wait for the next general TA meeting.
I completely agree with the statements made by Anon. at 10:08AM. I also suspect that the TA doesn't want to make too many waves with CW in the hope that CW will favor them in the sale process . All I can say to that is "fat chance"
ReplyDelete12:44 not quite true.
ReplyDelete1. "There's heavy machinery buzzing around the site meaning they're getting ready to break ground and that means there have to be plans"
Actually they broke ground long ago.
Heavy machinery does not mean there have to be plans. It means there were plans long ago. They filed them with DOB early last Autumn.
2. "we'll finally get to see exactly what's being proposed"
It is not "proposed". It has been planned and is being executed.
Big difference. They hid the plans for over a year since they began surveying for bedrock last April.
And all we would get is their spin on the "rezoning" but not the truth. We have the truth. And we have seen the proposal in STR's posting of the photo.
Now YOU CAN GET A LEGAL alert on your phone. texted.
ReplyDeleteanyone get this???????
This is nothing more than Crisis Management 101. Have a meeting and tell tenants what they want tenants to think.
ReplyDeleteFact is they already broke ground digging and excavating for 2 weeks. The construction is pretty far along.
This meeting is about crisis management spinning the facts for any upcoming investigations.
The meeting is about covering up what has been revealed.
Nothing more.
This meeting is not about any care for the tenants or tenants quality of life or caring what we think of rezoning. Come on - history shows there is no care for the tenants.
Really does anyone think they woke up and said let's show some care for the tenants and give them the truth?
After 2 yrs of discussion, some people here are still misinformed. The TA has no business or communal standing whatsoever in the sale of the property. Zero! CW's responsibility is to get as much money as it can for the bondholders through open bidding and to ensure that the winner can indeed deliver the money. That's it. This has nothing to do with Garodnick and nothing to do the TA at all. God only know why the TA has involved itself in this at all. CW doesn't care about them. Brookfield doesn't even care about them. An endorsement doesn't hurt, but Brookfield will do what it feels is best for Brookfield. So what is gained by the TA? If Brookfield wins, maybe some favored treatment for the TA board. And when the governing committee is set up, between a coalition of Brookfield and former TA Board members who are getting favored treatment, Brookfield could be governing this place far beyond the 5 yrs allowed by law. The TA's involvement in all this is nothing but suspect. If they had any humility (hah!) and integrity, they'd withdraw.
ReplyDeleteTo 1:13 and 1:35,
ReplyDeleteThis current version of the TA will NEVER be relevant again. It is more likely they will be sued by tenants than they will do any good for tenants. I hope you're right about the MCI thing because they have a lot at stake. If they kill the deal CW already offered and we get less they will be held liable.
You people will NEVER get anything accomplished in StuyTown without boots on the ground. TA or no TA, it's up to the people who live in the community to change things. The "TA" is nothing but a few people on a board, who can't accomplish anything without support. This office construction affects at least 5 buildings, each with about 100 apartments. What's that represent ? a couple of thousand people ? Who's organizing those people to become a voice ?
ReplyDeleteI don't give a shit if the TA is looking to buy the place or not, but people have a choice to either help the Tenants Association be a political force, or to create their own group, but for gods sake, stop bitching about all this and DO SOMETHING !, because it isn't going to happen without real people taking real action.
I expect to see people on the corners of 16th & 18th St. with clipboards Monday, signing up people for the rally.
The TA have been over for a long time.
ReplyDelete5:43 why don't you be the one doing what you say someone else should be doing with clip boards and rally.
ReplyDeleteit seems to me a lot of tenants are doing something.
everyone do your thing be it rallies, rent strikes, challenges to the DOB, whatever way you want to stand up and fight.
I'm all for group action. I just don't want to hear that we should be supporting the TA. Either the TA needs to have new board elections or another group needs to be formed. The current board will never have my support.
ReplyDelete@February 7, 2014 at 11:12 PM
ReplyDeleteYou are exactly what's wrong with the community. When someone exhorts you to take action, you turn around and point the finger at them and say, "why don't YOU do it ?".
Good luck buddy.
If a sale goes through, there will probably be 2 organizations. A condo or co-op board of governors and the TA. The voting power on the board is supposed to be determined through majority of representational ownership. By law that can be winning developer for only 5 years. During the first 5 years, if tenant (renter) issues come up, the TA would probably be the advocacy group having to deal in effect with the developer. After 5 years, the TA would be the renters' advocacy group dealing with the board of governors. Tenants on one side & former tenants on the other. So the TA as an entity will be quite important. Rather than reinvent the wheel, I think the best solution is for new faces to run when the TA board elections come up again. But this time it would be good if these were well publicized elections with some public speaking venues so the community can get a chance to really see & evaluate who's running.
ReplyDeleteBring back Al Doyle! No more Swamps!
ReplyDeleteWhy is John Marsh AKA Peter Stuyvesant REposting comments already made by others? Someone show him how to use Facebook please.
ReplyDelete>>Why is John Marsh AKA Peter Stuyvesant REposting comments already made by others? Someone show him how to use Facebook please.<<
ReplyDeleteMarsh is trying to "fix things." BTW, "Peter Stuyvesant" is not Marsh all the time. The TA Communications Team is "Peter Stuyvesant." Marsh seems not to have been around last weekend when the deletion of posts began. Someone else was at the helm. But I don't think we will ever find out who.
>>Tenants on one side & former tenants on the other.<<
ReplyDeleteWho will be at odds with each other from day one... or at least day two.
Really think a tenant bid will be successful ? Read this...
ReplyDeleteBlackstone, Starwood win in CWCapital sale
1:08 AM
ReplyDeleteGood luck with your group action idea. Some tenants tried to keep the mid-lease protest going on their own but it fizzled out due to lack of interest. I'm not the least bit optimistic.
I'll be happily proved wrong. Try organizing a leasing office or management office protest on your own, see how it goes. This blog is a good place to post notices. If people show, you can call T&V to cover it and get more visibility.
All this antipathy toward the TA must be music to CW's ears, especially as the TA is trying to negotiate the bank-busting MCIs and retro charges. Some of us are really hoping they will be successful in getting us some relief here.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of MCIs, I saw on the TA fb page that at least one tenant has been made to pay his retro charge for a PAR he filed and which was, of course, denied by DHCR, all in one lump sum. Isn't this illegal?
I know the TA isn't perfect, but I HATE all this hostility toward them.
Very depressed lately re the QOL issues here (construction destruction, the drunken Bro/Dude/Like/OMG screaming herds, not a rug in sight with new tenants, real PCVST tenants, not transients, battling amongst themselves, dog feces everywhere, etc).I think this sums it all up:
ReplyDeleteFinally Spermwhale Whalen spoke. He said, “I know shit rolls downhill. But why am I always livin in the valley?”
The Choirboys- By Joseph Wambaugh
STR What happened to your link to the big dig photos?
ReplyDeleteThe TA was on the wrong side of this fight. They should have stepped up before the trees were cut and should have opposed from the beginning, before when the land was surveyed for bedrock in April 2013.
ReplyDeleteThis was never OK with us tenants but the TA chose to ignore us and side with CW. This is not OK and can't be fixed.
From November:
“It’s mostly fill,” said Steinberg, “so there’ll be trucks removing earth and pretty much that side of the building (the First Avenue) side will be impassable,” she said. “People will have to use the loop side.”
Part of the project however includes upgrades for a nearby Playground 8, including the addition of a water feature. Steinberg added that management conceded some trees will have to come down in order to extend the back part of the building.
http://town-village.com/2013/10/18/cw-talks-plans-for-new-management-office/
I bet Steinberg doesn't live in one of the affected buildings.
ReplyDelete1:06 pm I hope you are right because CW Capital JP Morgan and Brookfield Asset Management are all in bed together yet we tenants would be the only ones getting screwed in that deal. The so called independent report done by JP Morgan on the sale to Brookfield Tenant bid as best option was biased.
ReplyDelete>>STR What happened to your link to the big dig photos?<<
ReplyDeleteI deleted it after I further investigated the site. Initially, when I just saw the photographs, I was delighted that a tenant had taken upon himself the online project of documenting, via photos, the progress of the management building. Then I came to the "Discussion" section and found that whether by intent or not the site is a shill for the TA and Garodnick. For instance, there's a request for donations to "our legal fund" that leads straight to the TA page. I'll monitor the site to see what direction it takes and may offer up a link in the future, but I'm serious about disassociating myself the TA and anything it does. This is why the TA website and the TA Facebook have been removed from the blog's links section. My attitude may be churlish to some, but I don't care, and I won't be persuaded to change my course. I'm very enthusiastic and energized about researching ways in which tenants can help themselves without relying on the TA or Garodnick, and that's where most of my PCVST energies are going to be directed.
Good for you,STR. We trust you. Well, at least I do.
DeleteGood God. There is NO tenant bid. There is NO TA bid. Brookfield will make a bid. And the TA Board has announced that it will trail behind Brookfield trying to pick up crumbs.
ReplyDeleteSTR I support you in:
ReplyDelete"I'm very enthusiastic and energized about researching ways in which tenants can help themselves without relying on the TA or Garodnick, and that's where most of my PCVST energies are going to be directed."
To be led by the TA is to be misled.
They should be steadfast on tenant's side. Steadfast.
Manipulating and controlling when and what information tenants are given, recently with deleting then false! posting new photo rendering of offices as if its news! to coordinate with Town & Village article and Dan's letter to MacArthur to control tenants is wrong.
This TA's choice to operate as authoritarian is the worse form of leadership in the modern world. Controlling the tenants only helps CW.
Empowering tenants helps tenants. We tenants need to fight for ourselves because there is no one in the present NYC administration from Community Board 6 up to Cuomo who is protecting and empowering tenants as adamantly as they are protecting and empowering the RE industry.
A link to donate to the TA legal fund on the big dig site?
ReplyDeleteAre you bloody serious?
They are exploiting this mess they made to profit their legal fund. Disgusting.
The TA didn't oppose the construction,
Steinberg promoted the construction in the press, and now they want tenants to give them money because the construction is god awful?!
The TA wants to make money exploiting this awful mess they made that we have to live with is bloody outrageous.
They didn't help tenants oppose it and have been giving tenants massive grief for opposing it.
I won't give them a dime probably ever but most certainly not before I see them plant tall trees for each and every tree they killed in the Oval and on First Ave site.
Its clear tenants are better off NOT following the calculated Garodnick and TA shenanigans. Sad what they did to First Ave.
ReplyDeleteNYC has this incredible gem of affordable middle class housing that by all accounts should be a model to the country on how to preserve middle class affordable housing yet this Cuomo run state is failing miserably at affordable housing and middle class protections. Failures.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteI want to believe there is no Brookfield Tenant Bid because that would be disastrous. I don't have good understanding of this process. What does it mean when Garodnick says:
http://garodnick.ngphost.com/press-release/stuyvesant-town-tenants-and-council-member-garodnick-announce-new-bid-buy-property
The Stuyvesant Town-Peter Cooper Village Tenants Association and Brookfield Asset Management announced that they will partner to bid for the storied development as part of a tenant-led proposal that would protect current residents and permanently maintain the middle-class character of the historic Stuyvesant Town / Peter Cooper Village community.
The Board of the Tenants Association approved an agreement with Brookfield to develop a bid over the coming months to submit to CW Capital, the special servicer that represents senior bondholders.
NY politicians have FAILED Stuyvesant Town Peter Cooper Village.
ReplyDeleteI am not voting for any incumbents in this election year.
Not a single one.
>>What does it mean when Garodnick says:<<
ReplyDeleteThere's no date on that, but it seems from a couple of years ago.
That pinned "Management Office What's Going On" on the TA Facebook is a mess of reposted comments from the banned thread. Was it worth it just to make the TA and Dan look on top of things?
ReplyDelete10:28 I think they would rather tenants believe that they are trying to look on top of things but really they are trying to cover up they condoned this all along.
ReplyDeleteTo them a sloppy attempt to look like they are on top of it is better than the truth they were pro-construction offices, pro-tear down the trees. Better to look sloppy than complicit.
They can't cover up Susan Steinberg's comments to the press though. We all saw it already.
This office construction is a pretty egregious assault on the property. I guess they think its better to be late to speak out against it than to have residents know they knew all along and were fine with it.
ReplyDeleteBoth the construction project and the way they all went about it is offensive and insulting to our intelligence.
No amount of back peddling can cover up TA and Dan's "big dig" against PCVST.
ReplyDeleteSTR, fwiw, I know that the moderator who was going through the posts correcting writing style and deleting "bad" words, was a female. The reason I know: I had a PM exchange with her and she said she was a woman within the context of our exchange. I don't know if that was the same moderator who removed the post and comments that caused the current controversy, but I doubt that it was John Marsh who did that.
ReplyDeleteI know it wasn't Marsh, because when I contacted him, he said he'd get back to me, as he had to exam what had occurred.
ReplyDeleteAs I wrote in a previous comment:
ReplyDelete>>Marsh is trying to "fix things." BTW, "Peter Stuyvesant" is not Marsh all the time. The TA Communications Team is "Peter Stuyvesant." Marsh seems not to have been around last weekend when the deletion of posts began. Someone else was at the helm. But I don't think we will ever find out who.<<
"Marsh seems not to have been around last weekend when the deletion of posts began. Someone else was at the helm. But I don't think we will ever find out who.<<"
ReplyDeleteMaybe was Steinberg. She should be ashamed of herself for being so in bed with CW on this outrage, whether she's the post deleter or not.
"Marsh seems not to have been around last weekend when the deletion of posts began. Someone else was at the helm. But I don't think we will ever find out who."
ReplyDeleteCould have been Soni Fink. I think she is their communications person.
I never got the impression that Steinberg was that enamored of CWCapital or the previous landlord.
ReplyDeleteNot nice to publish names unless you know.
ReplyDeleteAnd no one said that we know.
ReplyDelete"Not nice to publish names unless you know."
ReplyDeleteAgreed. Otherwise, It's just gossip and speculation, both of which can be very damaging to the people named.
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Also, with respect from a big fan of yours, STR, you made the following two contradictory statements:
"I know it wasn't Marsh, because when I contacted him, he said he'd get back to me, as he had to exam what had occurred."
"And no one said that we know."
The fact is that you don't know for sure that it wasn't Marsh.
While I don't agree with the TA removing valid, legitimate posts (like the link to the STR post concerning the construction), the TA has to have some strict moderation in place because it used to be hijacked by a nest of vipers who would troll for the specific purpose of insulting other posters. These sickos violated both TA and FB TOS, and practically closed down the TA page as well as driving away many posters who were the victims of their spiteful assaults.
ReplyDelete>>Agreed. Otherwise, It's just gossip and speculation, both of which can be very damaging to the people named.<<
ReplyDeleteI debated about letting through a name, but since the commentator just mentioned the possibility of her being a member of the "Communications Team," I let it go. If this person wishes to have this deleted, she should feel free to contact me and I will delete her name.
I also don't know how naming names in the Communications Team is damaging. The TA (in the person of John Marsh) has stood up for the deletion of that post, so the overlords of the TA agree with the policy, it seems. Why would this be damaging, unless the policy is wrong? The TA certainly doesn't think so, therefore, why the secrecy over who deleted the post? Stand up for what you believe, I say.
Regarding not knowing if it was Marsh, I've made that conclusion primarily from my communication with him, in which it was clear to me that he didn't remove the post and was away when it was done.
"Regarding not knowing if it was Marsh, I've made that conclusion primarily from my communication with him, in which it was clear to me that he didn't remove the post and was away when it was done."
ReplyDeleteMaybe it wasn't Marsh who removed the post, but surely being "away" doesn't make a difference if you have computer access?
BTW, I am easily accessible to the board of the TA, having had communication with its president several times before. I even seem to remember that I was once asked by Marsh to hold back a story, or even remove it (I forget the details now), because the TA was planning something and wanted a clear path for their intentions without management catching on to the plan before it became actualized. I acquiesced. But the removal of a TA Facebook post that just showed how the new management office would look? There's no plan in that, other than making the TA and Garodnick look proactive, though I don't discount that it was "personal," too.
ReplyDeleteThe TA are the most technically, un-savvy group of people on the planet. Their missteps are a reflection of their incompetence not their malice.
ReplyDelete8:52 unfortunately that isn't true since John Marsh is an expert computer programmer by trade. So sadly its not incompetence.
ReplyDeleteI am no fan of John Marsh, believe me, but I am nearly certain he's a lawyer, not a computer programmer. Either way, STR, it seems pretty odd to just let people post all these weird accusatory comments about fellow residents, even if they are on the TA. It is actually defamation if they are false. It's not a private conversation (which is still defamation, believe it or not, but in reality, who would actually know about it?). It is reckless to let through these posts for the public to read that actually name people by name for admittedly stupid accusations that nobody but the gossips on this blog care about, but still, accusations without any merit, just randomly accusing people of thing by name. Many people on the TA obviously know who you are, so it's not like you can hide behind an anonymous blog or say, some anonymous said it, not me. It is defamation just to let through and post other people's rather dumb but potentially false and malicious comments on your blog.
ReplyDeleteI would be a tad more careful since the TA members are clearly reading it. Trivial as it might seem to you, it's well within their power and the law to sue you, not the plethora of anonymouses, for posting other people's false accusations. I would keep the conversation general about the TA (or "college students" or whomever the group enemy of the week is) and not let the posters start hurling accusations about real people.
Thank you for the threat, but, AGAIN, if someone named wants their name removed from the two "possibilities" mentioned, just contact me. It's that simple.
ReplyDeleteAnd, AGAIN, the people mentioned were mentioned just as possibilities: "maybe," "could have been"...
And it's not a secret who is on the TA board:
http://www.stpcvta.org/about
Perhaps the TA can sue itself for naming its officers and directors.
BTW, getting threatened like this, pisses me off a bit. So I investigated just who is, or was, in charge of communications at the TA. Bingo.
ReplyDelete"I am no fan of John Marsh, believe me, but I am nearly certain he's a lawyer, not a computer programmer."
ReplyDeleteJeez. This is getting crazier by the minute. John Marsh is NOT a lawyer.
And, STR, just what is "Bingo." supposed to mean?
"BTW, getting threatened like this, pisses me off a bit. So I investigated just who is, or was, in charge of communications at the TA. Bingo."
ReplyDeleteHall monitors at it again, STR?
"Bingo" means that the person named is, or was, in charge of communications for the TA. Whether that is true now, or whether the person deleted the FA Facebook post, is another matter, of course.
ReplyDeleteAnd, yes, Marsh is not a lawyer.
ReplyDelete"Perhaps the TA can sue itself for naming its officers and directors"
LOL so hard!
Whoever is writing for "Peter Stuyvesant" sounds like a very old woman. The colloquialisms are prehistoric.
ReplyDelete