Anyone who appreciates and sits around the Oval will realize the truth of what I'm saying: The Oval has become one big receptacle for dog urine and feces. Urine streams run across the walkway, and dog crap smears (or worse, unpicked dog dumps) layer the same walkway. On certain days, you can't avoid the noxious smell arising from these deposits. At the Oval Cafe dogs are not allowed on the patio, but you wouldn't know it, considering that dog owners frequently violate this rule, with no one caring for the most part. Today I even spotted a pooch on one of the stone chess tables near the cafe, the little one's ass firmly planted on the board, which later will be used by adults and children as a food table.
Stuyvesant Town and Peter Cooper Village will always be slum-like unless the dog situation is not altered, irregardless of how much "lipstick on a pig" landscaping is done.
Of course, we are dealing with a basic situation that dogs are allowed in STPCV. This change, instituted by ex-landlord Rob Speyer, has been devastating to this complex, plunging it in a few years into slumhood and a further division among tenants. There appears to be no solution. But, perhaps, there is a solution. And even more than one.
Firstly, CWCapital should seriously consider a moratorium on new dog ownership in the complex. The big problem with that is that its enforcement would be lax, so realistically a moratorium could only be a symbol that more dogs will not be allowed in STPCV.
Secondly, CWCapital should seriously consider banning dogs from the entire Oval, period. Just as the riding of bicyles is not allow along the walkway, neither should dogs be allowed. At the very least, this would free the Oval from the urine and shit stains and their accompanying smells. It would also mean that dog owners would not be tempted to break the dog rules at the Oval Cafe or place their dogs on chess tables and have them urinate around those chess tables. It would also mean that those living about the Oval would not be bothered at all times of the day, including early morning hours, by the piercing barking of dogs who are socializing with each other. Of course, as with everything here, enforcement would have to be tight and it usually isn't. But the persistence of Public Safety in this matter, with guards posted periodically about the Oval, should make an impact.
Thirdly, CWCapital should consider a further extension of the banning of dogs in the complex, moving acceptable dog areas to the perimeters of the complex, even to the street. The back areas of STPCV are continual dumping grounds for dog urine and feces, too, and the noise of barking dogs in the early morning hours are as equally, if not more, disruptive to tenants who may want to sleep past 7am.
Ultimately, whoever will wind up owning this complex will have to address the dog situation and institute some firm rules and provide enforcement of those rules. The dog population in STPCV is increasing rapidly. If nothing is done, pretty soon this place will be for the dogs. Unfortunately, it's probably for the dogs already.
53 comments:
Thank you for this post. And how about this: posting signs at our entrances that say outside dogs are not allowed. Yes, this will be laxly enforced, if at all, but maybe some outsiders will be deterred from coming in. Best case scenario: such signs would replace the Greenmarket and "More" signs that are so prominent and unnecessary.
Definitely.
Oh STR there you go again spreading your divisive anti-dog agenda. Question: why do you not hold CW/CompassRock accountable for maintaining clean sidewalks? Why not in your proposed radical "solutions" demand that CW hose down the Oval paths every morning?? It's the law and they should do it! They blow leaves around every morning for hours for pete's-sake.
And who are you to proclaim 'Truth' across the land on behalf of everyone who uses the Oval? Did you do a survey? My dog and I socialize happily (and lawfully) with our neighbors on the Oval paths and many older residents especially love cuddling with the dog. Public Safety has more than sufficient manpower to enforce the designated no-dog areas and other rules. There are many here who love dogs, and pet-owners who do not contribute to the problems of grounds degradation. Your new proposed rules will cause further divisiveness.
1:10 p.m.: "why do you not hold CW/CompassRock accountable for maintaining clean sidewalks?"
Because if tenants and outsiders behaved properly, we wouldn't need to police them. The primary responsibility is with the dog owners.
"who are you to proclaim 'Truth' across the land on behalf of everyone who uses the Oval?"
It's STR's blog--STR can say whatever STR wants.
"Oh STR there you go again spreading your divisive anti-dog agenda."
The bad behavior of many, if not most, dog owners has caused the division, not STR or any of us. Those of us who object to filth on the once-clean walkways and interior spaces and the added noise of barking dogs are REACTING to the situation. We're not causing it. You want to help? Get your fellow dog owners to take responsibility for the situation.
>>Question: why do you not hold CW/CompassRock accountable for maintaining clean sidewalks? Why not in your proposed radical "solutions" demand that CW hose down the Oval paths every morning?<<
CW should be held accountable for not maintaining clean sidewalks, but to maintain them they'd have to bring out the Stuy Town zamboni at least two times a day, if not more often. With an ever growing dog population here, can't you see the problems multiplying?
maybe there are a few nice buildings left that are quiet, sort of and somewhat clean. I'm looking for a one br for my sister, mature, quiet, clean, non smoker with no pets. If anyone likes their building and would recommend, please email me.
Really would like a nice tenant to have a nice home.
If tenants behaved properly we wouldn't have to fence off all the lawns to prevent them from forging new paths. This isn't a dog issue, it's a "CWCAPITAL lets whoever do whatever whenever" issue. They are an inexperienced management company and it shows.
An ode to CW Capital/Compass Cock, and all the irresponsible dog owners and, of course, the canines:
"Shit" said the King...
and ten thousand asses strained in the sun...
all over the Oval.
Yes- something must be done about the dogs. CW must be aware of this problem but they do nothing. Should we get a petition up to stop this mass influx of dogs!??? !! I would never buy here if dogs are allowed. There are more people here without dogs, so majority should rule . We must be forceful in order for this to work -before this place gets worse- if that is possible. Not too optimistic about the response but we can try.
One would have to suffer from a strong fecal affinity to not see that that the allowance of dogs have resulted in the turning of the property into a sewer. Just today I passed three piles of shit around the first avenue loop. As far as the idea that "a small few are ruining it for everyone else", well that's a crock. I have yet to see a dog owner NOT let their dogs piss and crap in flower beds and on trees. Even if shit is picked up, it leaves that lovely residue. Do tell dog owners, how exactly do you pick up your dog's piss? How does that work? Suppose there were residents who would prefer not to see and smell puddles of piss at the base of garbage cans and signs on the property?
STR, we have to realize that when the masters of the universe try to rent apartments in a project for market rates it's just not practical to turn people away who are willing to pay because they have a dog. That was our undoing. Back in the day, as you know, there were long waits to get an apartment here, and if you didn't like the no dog policy then find someplace else to live. I still believe that our only hope of some progress regarding this issue is a conversion, although this appears to be less and less likely. Zero communication from the TA doesn't tend to foster a positive attitude.
I'm so sick of these dog owner defenders. When are these people going to realize that everywhere else in NYC dog owners are required to curb their dogs. I have filed a report with the sanitation dept about PCV. I hope others do the same about ST. If dogs are going to be an ongoing reality thanks to the Speyers, then bring your dogs to the loops and streets. No pissing and crapping on the sidewalks. That's NYC sanitation ordinance.
CW is an inexperienced property manager. They should be held accountable for maintaining clean sidewalks as per city ordinance.
CW has a Zamboni street sweeper that cleans the loop roads once a week. They can use the same machine for the outer loop road on the Oval. In addition, every day, human laborers can use brooms and trash bins on wheels and litter picker uppers. Third, commercial property owners citywide hose off their sidewalks once a day with some cleanser. This is what CW should be doing.
I'm a dog owner who lives in PCV and I cannot AGREE more w STR has his/her assessment of the situation!
98% of dog owners are lazy and ignore the rules doing what's best for them and their dogs with NO consideration for their neighbors.
Since there is no enforcement and the dog owners act equal parts self entitled and ignorant of the rules I don't have any confidence in things improving.
Dogs can be trained to do many things...including doing their business on the exterior of the property.
The TA leadership is too busy trying to get De Blasio elected Mayor . Given De Blasio's acceptance of huge donations from real estate interests, at best he will be marginally better than Bloomberg , which means he will do little that is constructive for the middle class.
How well is the bike ban going?
Solution is to
1) Cap the number of dog permits at 500 max (5% of all households). This would have to be achieved via attrition, so no new permits issued.
2) Require all dogs to wear large, easily spotted tags while on the grounds.
3) Vigorous enforcement. No tag, escort them off the property!
I wonder how many dogs there are in STPCV?
1 MILLION DOGS N THAT IS ONLY IN PCV:):):)ST HAS 5 MILLION DOGS!!!!!!!! LOL
Good points 807p.
THE PROBLEM IS CWCAPITAL. NOT DOGS, BIKES OR STUDENTS. THEY DONT KNOW HOW TO HANDLE THE SITUATIONS THEY CREATE. THEY ARE AN INEXPERIENCED MANAGEMENT COMPANY.
Stop complaining & do something. Here's a link:
http://www1.nyc.gov/apps/311/allServices.htm?requestType=listService&filterServ=Complaint&serviceName=Dog+or+Animal+Waste+Complaint&intentId=3C132E8E-8138-11DE-8E9F-96DAE110FEB8
Please note...from the city's website: "The City requires property owners to clean up animal waste on their property and adjoining sidewalks and gutters even if they do not own the pet, stray, or wild animal making the waste."
Curb your dog is not a law!
And yet no comments regarding the 3 tons of mulch dumped in the 14th Street Oval.
OK, the area in front of the small fountain in PCV has been aerated, mixed with top soil and is starting to be lined with boxwoods. Boxwoods are somewhat resistant to dog pee. With close to a hundred dogs all peeing in the same spots, "somewhat resistant" may not matter. So this area will be what it has been: the closest thing to a dog run in the entire complex. For better or worse I've registered a complaint with the Dept of Sanitation about the dogs taking their dumps on the sidewalks.
If there is a low voter turnout for sty town it's probably because 525 E 14 is very well hidden and there is no signage on 14 St. I encountered many lost souls looking for it. Mostly older people who used to voting right on 14th street.
@Tommyboy, NYC health code prohibits animals from creating a nuisance on the sidewalk, and NY State created the "pooper scooper law" that says if your dog does go on the sidewalk, you are required to pick it up.
Lots of pittbuls with blue tags in pcvst.
How did these pitt owners get their tags?
Stop complaining & do something. Here's a link:
"http://www1.nyc.gov/apps/311/allServices.htm?requestType=listService&filterServ=Complaint&serviceName=Dog+or+Animal+Waste+Complaint&intentId=3C132E8E-8138-11DE-8E9F-96DAE110FEB8
Please note...from the city's website: "The City requires property owners to clean up animal waste on their property and adjoining sidewalks and gutters even if they do not own the pet, stray, or wild animal making the waste.""
I've complained in the past. I wish something could and would be done. Unfortunately, nothing ever changes. It looks like it's going to be Shitown forever. Even in a perfect world where dog owners pick up their shit, the property will remain a dog toilet will it not? Do you think dog owners are going to walk around with a bucket of water to clean off the shit residue and to dilute the puddles of piss they leave behind? The property will never be what it was and I suppose it was naive to think that it could.
Irregardless isn't a word.
I particularly love when the self-involved, entitled dog owners who live here -- or come in here from the outside to use STPCV as a toilet for their pooches -- let their dogs with their dirty feet and shit-residue-laden behinds sit on the benches where unsuspecting people will subsequently sit down. GROSS. And heaven forbid mis-Management should have their Security staff tell people that their dogs have to sit on the ground...where they belong!
>>Irregardless isn't a word.<<
It most definitely is a word.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/irregardless
FEE FI FO FUM!
THE GRAMERCY ARMPIT IS STILL A SLUM!
PANTIES ON THE FLOOR?
LOVELIES DOING KEG STANDS?
SORRORITY SIDEBOOB?
THREE THINGS YOU WON'T FIND AT MANSE SPEYER!
YOUNG ROBERT IS THRIVING IN THE PHARMACEUTICAL INDUSTRY!
HE INVENTED A 'MORNING AFTER PILL' FOR GOATS
AS YOU WERE!
I can see that the landscaping around the large area by the PCV fountain will include 2 layers of boxwoods and two outer layers of smaller plants surrounded by mulch. This approach may work...that is, may keep the plants alive. It all depends on the dog owners. In most cases if the dogs pull them in a direction, the owners will go with the dogs. I believe at least half the owners will let the dogs pull them into the planted areas and of course the plants will die. We'll see. One thing I will say...the current landscaping is much more tasteful, much more thoughtful than what was overseen by Tishman-Speyer. Continuing confirmation that the Tishman-Speyer group was headed up by a group of abnormally crude slobs.
To: "I've complained in the past. I wish something could and would be done. Unfortunately, nothing ever changes."
There's a difference here thanks to this blog. City workers response to 2 things: Politicians and numbers. I don't expect Garodnick to go to bat over the dog-sanitation issue. He'd lose dog owner support. But if everybody coming to this blog goes to the link and files a complaint, then we have numbers. It's not sufficient to complain and complain here. That does little or nothing. You have to do something. Or at least try.
Again with the goats!!!
To "I can see the landscaping...in PCV":
That whole area in front of the fountain is being fenced off. Dogs can't get in there...not even to mark the trees. This means that outside of the loops and streets, the only places to go will be the sidewalks and the few places that aren't fenced off. It's for sure that the dog owners will find those areas not fenced off and everything within them will die. Also they'll just let the dogs go on the sidewalks which is against sanitation dept regulations. Everybody needs to register online complaints with the sanitation dept to stop this.
"That whole area in front of the fountain is being fenced off. Dogs can't get in there...not even to mark the trees. This means that outside of the loops and streets, the only places to go will be the sidewalks and the few places that aren't fenced off. It's for sure that the dog owners will find those areas not fenced off and everything within them will die. Also they'll just let the dogs go on the sidewalks which is against sanitation dept regulations. Everybody needs to register online complaints with the sanitation dept to stop this."
While I've filed complaints in the past, I'll file another one on Monday. Maybe if everyone complains they'll do something (everyone who prefers not having shit all over the property that is).
I've just filed a complaint with the city about the traffic islands on 23rd Street that have become a garbage dump. It seems that management doesn't maintain them and that because they have trees, the responsibility is the Parks Dept. (The trees haven't been taken care of at all.) Since I gave 311 my email, I got a confirmation that allowed me to submit 3 photos, videos, or sound recordings.
While I was tooling around the 311 site, I saw that it's possible to file a complaint about barking dogs. If I'd known that, I would have done so about the tenants underneath me instead of relying on management.
My point is: If you make a complaint to 311, give them your email address so you can then submit photos or videos of the problem.
where exactly on the sanitation website does one file dog complaints?
Dog complaints: "http://www1.nyc.gov/apps/311/allServices.htm?requestType=listService&filterServ=Complaint&serviceName=Dog+or+Animal+Waste+Complaint&intentId=3C132E8E-8138-11DE-8E9F-96DAE110FEB8
STR...maybe you can promote this link. Also since you document so much, would be great if you could fill out complaints too with pix.
Is this post a joke? I assume it is, if you felt that strongly about noise, dogs, people who are not like you, etc., then venturing past comfortable confines of STPCV into the rude, loud, smelly, uncivilized Manhattan would be absolutely devastating to your refined senses.
Oh, how I've missed you, Jerry's Fat Ass!
As you were.
Hey 6:24...maybe you haven't caught on yet. STR is far from alone.
It's illegal in the state of California to bring dogs into greenmarkets. I would think this is because having snout and ass in one's food is unhealthy and unsanitary. I was wondering why this law doesn't exist in NY. Walk in any greenmarket and see for yourself the dogs smelling and backing up into fruit and vegetable bins. Surprisingly, their owners aren't paying much attention to what their dogs are doing. By extension, since dogs are allowed into greenmarkets in ny, then why can't they be brought into whole foods and associated? Why are these dog owners being discriminated against? It can't be a health hazard if they're allowed into the greenmarkets right?
Honestly, I respect dog owners right to not mind ass and snout in their food, but is it too much to ask them to respect my right to do without it? That's the kicker. We all have to live in the cesspool that they create whether we like it or not.
Even as a dog-owner, I despise the mess dogs leave. But I credit this to the landscapers attempt to "save the greenery" by placing hideous and embarrassing fences around every green space. My dog is trained to relieve himself on grass, where shockingly his feces is fertilizer (I do pick it up) and his urine soaks in so as not to be left sitting atop the cement to be trekked into our homes. By placing these fences around, you prevent EVERYONE from enjoying the grass. I pay for a "90-acre backyard" and find it infuriating that every space is being fenced off. I understand the oval is a dog-free space and support that fully. But every space doesn't need to be. And let's face it, it isn't like they do a great job of landscaping - those poor bushes they rip up every two weeks don't stand a chance.
I don't think you will like my upcoming post in which I defend the fencing.
Anon 9:58; Your ignorance that your dog's urine is fertilizer is EXACTLY why they are putting up ugly fencing. Your dog's -- and every dog's -- urine contains salts that kill grass and plants. Google it if you don't believe me.
"Even as a dog-owner, I despise the mess dogs leave. But I credit this to the landscapers attempt to "save the greenery" by placing hideous and embarrassing fences around every green space. My dog is trained to relieve himself on grass, where shockingly his feces is fertilizer (I do pick it up) and his urine soaks in so as not to be left sitting atop the cement to be trekked into our homes. By placing these fences around, you prevent EVERYONE from enjoying the grass. I pay for a "90-acre backyard" and find it infuriating that every space is being fenced off. I understand the oval is a dog-free space and support that fully. But every space doesn't need to be. And let's face it, it isn't like they do a great job of landscaping - those poor bushes they rip up every two weeks don't stand a chance."
Does anything else need to be said regarding whether or not allowing dogs at stuyvesant town was a mistake? Here's a dog owner demonstrating the self absorption that's so prevalent around here.
Take the fences down so I can have my dog bathroom back please!!!!!
@9:58 AM "My dog is trained to relieve himself on grass, where shockingly his feces is fertilizer (I do pick it up) and his urine soaks in so as not to be left sitting atop the cement to be trekked into our homes. By placing these fences around, you prevent EVERYONE from enjoying the grass."
So your dog is trained to relieve himself on grass....isn't that precious! You're supposed to CURB your dog. And who wants to go on grass that's been peed and pooped on by dogs? Yes, MORE FENCES PLEASE!
@ 9:58AM "My dog is trained to relieve himself on grass, where shockingly his feces is fertilizer"
Dog poop is fertilizer..... really? That's not what I've been reading. I too pay for the "90-acre backyard", to use your words, and I don't want dog pee and poop on the property.
"My dog is trained to relieve himself on grass..."
So RE-train them to pee and poop at the curb like nearly all city dogs do. When you move out (and YOU will) are you going to make special bathroom trips back here where there's grass so your dog doesn't explode? No. You'll either re-train them or (my money's on this one) you'll let them go wherever and whenever, whatever is quickest. Then, if no one's around you'll just walk away, especially if it's between cars where other sidewalk walkers wouldn't see it. Bonus points will not be given for those few times you're embarrassed into picking it up. Those little bag holders on the leash aren't just for show anymore.
9:58 a.m.: Your dog's urine and feces is raw sewage, not fertilizer. Educate yourself and then get over yourself and your little furry darling. And if you really want to be considerate, throw a bottle of water where your dog urinated to wash at least some of it away. You pick up its poop? Congratulations--you're following the law. Of course since you're not clairvoyant, you don't know if what comes out is going to be soft or solid. Fecal residue is not an amenity, no matter what Management would have you believe.
I love dogs but I really don't think they belong here.
This morning there was a freshly laid pile of sh*t in the elevator at 9 Stuy Oval...real classy, huh? And I can't tell you the number of times I've seen urine in the stairwells. I'm not sure if it is from the canines or the college students...lol...who knows? Luxury living for sure....NOT!
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